Lee Marsh

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Posts by Lee Marsh

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  125

  Mandated Shunning is a Crime

  by Lee Marsh in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  mandated shunning is on the rise around the world with devastating effects on millions of people.

  shunning that is mandated by organized groups to its members is a form of both physical and psychological violence against those people being shunned and cut off from their family and life-long relationships.

  mandated shunning means that the shunning is ordered from the top down.

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  Lee Marsh

  DrearyWeather

  There is an untold number of disfellowshipped ones who have returned to JW's and have been the vocal promoters of this policy, given interviews in assemblies and conventions.

  Are you not aware that every word on the program is scripted? Even when I was in they doctored every word to make it sound like it was coming from me when really it was what they wanted people hear. That was in the early 80s and I know they have gotten even stricter since then.

  And really, what is a person supposed to say. "oh I missed my family so much because of the shunning I had to come back so they would talk to me again."

  No they say they were sorry and missed serving Jehovah. They found out how bad and wicked the world was and realized there is only safety in Jehovah's Organization. They say what they are told to say and forced to leave out what no one should really hear.

  I was so upset the first time they forced me to say things on the platform that weren't exactly true in my words. Nope not good enough. it had to be in their words. And it never changed.
  
  
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  16

  How many people thought about suicide after they were disfellowshipped

  by Lee Marsh in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i know i was suicidal before i was disfellowshipped.

  and it got worse after i left.

  one night a friend told me that he went home the night before and wasn't sure if he would ever hear from me again.

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  Lee Marsh

  Not quite sure what you are trying to say Beth Sarim
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  16

  How many people thought about suicide after they were disfellowshipped

  by Lee Marsh in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i know i was suicidal before i was disfellowshipped.

  and it got worse after i left.

  one night a friend told me that he went home the night before and wasn't sure if he would ever hear from me again.

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  Lee Marsh

  I know I was suicidal before I was disfellowshipped. And it got worse after I left. One night a friend told me that he went home the night before and wasn't sure if he would ever hear from me again.

  My sister tried many times before finally succeeding in 2005.

  At a Meetup group I attended all 9 people in attendance said they had thought about suicide after they were disfellowshipped or left and experienced the shunning.

  The impact on a person's life it massive. You immediately lose every person, your way of life, even your God.

  Some people do it and the Witness family covers up the really reason for the death. Or they say it was because the person felt so guilty that they took their own life. Witnesses would never admit that it had anything to do with their own family shunning them.

  If you have been on this board for a while then you probably know there has been one or more people here who did take their own life. It was heart-breaking for many here who knew them.

  So did you think about it?

  Was it related to being disfellowshipped and then shunned?
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  125

  Mandated Shunning is a Crime

  by Lee Marsh in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  mandated shunning is on the rise around the world with devastating effects on millions of people.

  shunning that is mandated by organized groups to its members is a form of both physical and psychological violence against those people being shunned and cut off from their family and life-long relationships.

  mandated shunning means that the shunning is ordered from the top down.

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  Lee Marsh

  What we do know is there there is a very high incidence of people who commit suicide after being disfellowshipped.

  At a Meetup group I am in, a few years ago we had about 9 people in the group. Someone asked how many of us seriously thought about suicide after they were disfellowshipped. Every single person put their hand up. Every one!

  A few of them tried. They were glad they were still alive. We were glad they were still alive.

  But we have all read the stories of people who do commit suicide or the family covers up that it was a suicide. They will say it was because the person felt so guilty for what they did. But they would never admit that it was the harshness of the shunning policy.

  Everyone in that group felt like they lost everything. Every person they knew. Their entire way of life. Their entire belief system. Their God. In one moment, everything gone.

  I know I felt it. Everyone in that group felt it. My sister felt it and tried many times before she finally succeeded.

  Over the last 24 years of listening to ex-JWs countless people felt the same way.

  The numbers may have been higher before the internet became a safe place to fall.

  But the reality is that when you are immediately treated like the walking dead, it isn't a long step to thinking you might as well be dead.

  That is what the shunning policy does to people. How many of us needed therapy to deal with this traumatic hole in our lives?

  How many people have to die?
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  125

  Mandated Shunning is a Crime

  by Lee Marsh in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  mandated shunning is on the rise around the world with devastating effects on millions of people.

  shunning that is mandated by organized groups to its members is a form of both physical and psychological violence against those people being shunned and cut off from their family and life-long relationships.

  mandated shunning means that the shunning is ordered from the top down.

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  Lee Marsh

  Group: "Hi, we're a group with a lot of rules. We are pretty strict with our rules, but we love people that agree with us and hate the dissenters. We think former group members are super bad, and we don't talk to them. Here is a list of our rules. Do you want to join?"

  You: "Yep."

  Really. Do you really think they are that up-front about it?

  "oh yes. If your child decides to leave you won't be able to talk to him again unless he comes back. Still want to join?

  
  

  
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  35

  Help wanted finding images

  by Lee Marsh in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i am working on a project that requires proofs that the wts did say it and jws believe and follow it.. i have found some but google is giving me a hard time with some things.. as i go i will post requests for various images.

  they all must have a reference or at least post where i can find the reference and i will add it to the image.. both older and newer beliefs are welcome, especially flip-flops.. if you have something similar to what is already posted then more references the better.

  i know there are images of the structure of the wts.

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  Lee Marsh

  Thanks too for the link. I don't have that update.
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  35

  Help wanted finding images

  by Lee Marsh in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i am working on a project that requires proofs that the wts did say it and jws believe and follow it.. i have found some but google is giving me a hard time with some things.. as i go i will post requests for various images.

  they all must have a reference or at least post where i can find the reference and i will add it to the image.. both older and newer beliefs are welcome, especially flip-flops.. if you have something similar to what is already posted then more references the better.

  i know there are images of the structure of the wts.

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  Lee Marsh

  Those are great!!! Thank you
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  35

  Help wanted finding images

  by Lee Marsh in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i am working on a project that requires proofs that the wts did say it and jws believe and follow it.. i have found some but google is giving me a hard time with some things.. as i go i will post requests for various images.

  they all must have a reference or at least post where i can find the reference and i will add it to the image.. both older and newer beliefs are welcome, especially flip-flops.. if you have something similar to what is already posted then more references the better.

  i know there are images of the structure of the wts.

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  Lee Marsh

  I have been looking for this one and can't find it.

  not being in submission can result in disfellowshipping.

  submission could be on any level within the congregation

  • wife to husband
  • publishers to the WTS or elders
  • elders to anyone higher
  • children to parents

  just as long as it shows that refusal to be in submission can result in DFing. I saw plenty on not being in subjection can result in death but not DFing
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  23

  How to Legally Dissolve a Religious Organization

  by EasyPrompt in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  regarding the state dissolving a church organization.... .

  as posted in another thread, here is what is happening in japan, filing a court order to dissolve the unification church.... .

  https://www.eurasiareview.com/06092023-japan-seeks-court-order-to-dissolve-unification-church/.

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  Lee Marsh

  My huge awakening was to read Matthew 23. Not a verse here and there or just the parts that suited my purpose. But the whole things. "Woe to the Scribes and Pharisees..."

  And I took a hard look at how the WTS stood up against that chapter.

  MAJOR FAIL.

  That was brutal.

  It takes great courage to honestly look at that chapter and not make excuses for them. "Yes but..."

  Just read what it says and compare. Since I was a JW, it made sense to compare THAT group and not others. Members of those groups can do that.
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  125

  Mandated Shunning is a Crime

  by Lee Marsh in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  mandated shunning is on the rise around the world with devastating effects on millions of people.

  shunning that is mandated by organized groups to its members is a form of both physical and psychological violence against those people being shunned and cut off from their family and life-long relationships.

  mandated shunning means that the shunning is ordered from the top down.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
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  Lee Marsh

  MeanMrMustard

  There is nothing about removing an individual's right to decide who they talk to. Not one word.

  It is about a group telling people that they will die if they talk to the "mentally diseased" if that isn't hate speech I don't know what is? And they are using God to coerce people into doing what they want not to protect people but to prevent them from leaving too if they find out they have been lied to.

  In the WTS there is no honorable way to leave. There is no compromise. No "agree to disagree". You are the "walking dead" and if JWs have contact with us then they too are dead.

  People do have the right to join any group they want and believe what they want. They do not have the right to force others to join or believe the same thing.

  And the GROUP leaders do not have the right to force anyone to do things that are ethically wrong, no matter how much they want to control everyone.